Episode 5: The Truth About Leadership, Accountability & Difficult Conversations with Dan Singer

In this episode of The Truth About Healing, Dana sits down with business coach, EOS Implementer, Marine Corps leader, and longtime friend Dan Singer for a powerful conversation about leadership, communication, accountability, and the role discomfort plays in growth.

While this conversation starts with business, it quickly becomes clear that the same patterns that impact organizations also show up in our relationships, families, nervous systems, and personal healing journeys.

Together, Dana and Dan explore why so many people avoid difficult conversations, how unspoken expectations create resentment, and why growth often requires us to confront the things we'd rather ignore.

Whether you're a business owner, leader, therapist, parent, or simply someone trying to navigate life more intentionally, this conversation offers practical insights that extend far beyond the workplace.

In This Episode, We Discuss:

✔️ What EOS (Entrepreneurial Operating System) is and why it works

✔️ The surprising similarities between therapy and business coaching

✔️ Why communication breakdowns happen so often

✔️ How avoiding difficult conversations creates bigger problems later

✔️ The connection between leadership and self-awareness

✔️ Why accountability starts with looking in the mirror

✔️ How core values create clarity and alignment

✔️ The role of discomfort in growth and transformation

✔️ Why consistency matters more than motivation

✔️ How unresolved issues become "anchors" that hold individuals and organizations back

One of the most powerful takeaways from this conversation is simple:

The things we avoid are often the very things standing between us and the life, business, relationships, and healing we say we want.

Growth isn't found in comfort.

It's found in the willingness to face what feels uncomfortable and move forward anyway.

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Additional Resources

🧠 EMDR Resources for Clinicians & Clients
www.danacarretta.com/shop

🛠️ Recommended Therapy Tools, Regulation Resources & EMDR Systems for Clinicians
www.danacarretta.com/therapytools

🎁 Free Nervous System Resources
www.danacarretta.com/free

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Transcript

SPEAKER_05 0:12

Welcome to another episode of The Truth About Healing, a podcast that's here to challenge everything you think you knew about therapy. I'm Dana Koretiskine, EMDR and neuroinformed therapist. And I'm on a mission to help 10 million people change their patterns, relationships, and future generations by teaching them how to gain control of their nervous system. Let's go with it. Welcome everyone to another episode of the Truth About Healing podcast. I am here with my friend, my business coach, my everything I need to keep my ass in check, Dan Singer. Dan Singer is a team performance coach using the entrepreneur entrepreneurial, ooh, lots of owls, operating system framework, also known as EOS, to help leadership teams clarify vision, strengthen execution, and build healthy, functional organizations. He previously spent five years on the leadership team of a company running on EOS, helping scale the business from 14 million to 20 million before a successful private equity acquisition. In addition to his civilian career, Dan has served in the Marine Corps Reserve since 2009 and is currently an operations instructor with the Marine Corps Tactics and Operation Group in 29 Palms, California. So fancy. So many things. So many things.

SPEAKER_06 1:31

Marine Corps loves using a lot of momenture and big words, you know.

SPEAKER_05 1:34

I'm so excited for you being here. Yeah. I feel like this is going to be like one of the best episodes and many more to come.

SPEAKER_04 1:40

Yep.

SPEAKER_05 1:41

So let's just start with like EOS, what it is and who it's for. And, you know, we'll the conversation will flow as it always does.

SPEAKER_06 1:49

Yeah. So EOS is an operating system for business. So just a set of simple, practical tools to really help business owners get what they want from their business. Um, you know, you know what I do is really work with leadership teams on three things called vision, traction, and healthy. Vision is about getting that leadership team on the same page. Where is this business going? How are we gonna get there? On the Marine Corps side, that's really the commander's intent, right? The overall, what is the objective and the mission? Um, on the traction side of it, it's about instilling the focus, the discipline, and the accountability. So you're actually executing on that vision every day. Um, and we start to figure out what are the things that are gonna get us closer to there, what's the noise and distractions and eliminating those. And then I think really the biggest piece of it, which is really where we're gonna focus today, is on the healthy component, right? Making the leadership team a more cohesive, high performing, open and honest team. Um, because really what we see is the things that are truly holding businesses back, right? They would I say the anchors that you're dragging around is all the shit we're not talking about. Right. Right. It's the people that we know are kind of an issue that we haven't addressed. Um, it's all those difficult conversations that you're like, do I really want to fucking go through this right now and bring this up? And so we just kind of gloss over it, right?

SPEAKER_03 3:05

Right.

SPEAKER_06 3:05

Just kind of avoid 100%.

SPEAKER_03 3:08

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 3:08

Um, and what happens is, yeah, that makes today a little bit easier, but it makes tomorrow so much harder. Right. Um, and so so much of it, you know, 20% is really about the tools that we teach.

SPEAKER_01 3:19

Right.

SPEAKER_06 3:19

The other 80% of what I'm doing with clients is creating that environment where we can openly address those things, right? Put all that shit on the table, kind of put it into piles, find out where our alignment is. And then once we've sort of sorted through that mess, we come back to the tools and we're like, all right, now how do we execute in going forward with this?

SPEAKER_05 3:40

Right. Just like therapy.

SPEAKER_06 3:42

A hundred percent. Just like therapy. It's absolutely therapy.

SPEAKER_05 3:44

Yeah, yeah. It's wild. So we've um I've been doing EOS with you since oh, like a year and a half, maybe. Um, and the more and more I get into, the more like I'll shoot you a text like this is exactly like therapy. Yeah, like literally.

SPEAKER_01 3:57

Yep.

SPEAKER_05 3:57

It's just, you know, you have your treatment plan, your long-term objective, and then your short-term objectives, which are those quarterly rocks, right?

SPEAKER_06 4:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 4:04

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:05

100%.

SPEAKER_05 4:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:07

Um, it really is like the part of the work that I I truly love. Like I call my favorite clients the quality of life clients, right? The ones where initially when we start working together, it it appears as though the business is what we're focusing on. Right. But it's really not, right? Because all that stuff that's going on in the business gets carried forward, families, marriages, kids, personal life, right? You're that shit is weighing on you nonstop.

SPEAKER_01 4:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:34

And there comes a point where the realization of that, right, happens. And then once we work through those things in the business, all the outside stuff starts to fall in line too.

SPEAKER_02 4:47

Right.

SPEAKER_06 4:47

So when I have clients come in and they're like, hey, I went on a three-week vacation, like, didn't check an email, and the business is still going, and like my wife enjoys being around me again, or I'm at my kids' practices and I'm not the choke point.

SPEAKER_05 4:59

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 5:00

Right. And like I have a good relationship again. I'm like, that's what the fuck gets me going. You know, yeah, the revenue is cool, the profit's cool, like we need to focus on that stuff. But that's not where my yeah, my passion is like when that impacts real people's lives.

SPEAKER_05 5:13

Exactly. Because that's where, you know, you've heard me talk all the time about, you know, generational trauma and things, you know, a dysregulated nervous system impacts the people around us, right?

SPEAKER_03 5:22

Yep.

SPEAKER_05 5:22

So and I'm I've been a hot mess. Like when things in the company were, you know, falling apart, that does affect my kids. I see them like having tantrum stuff, and I'm like, ooh, what are they picking up on?

unknown 5:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 5:33

So the the craziest, I have a a good amount of family businesses. Um, and so you want to talk about like generational trauma, like smashed into the business, right? It's like the delineation between Thanksgiving and the fucking Monday morning screaming matches. Like, there's it's so intertwined and messy. Um, but those are the ones I like because it's like there's no guide for this, right? You're just kind of relying on your ability to have some empathy, um, social intelligence, emotional intelligence. It's huge to be able to create space on both sides and find that commonality of like, hey, look, you guys both have valid viewpoints, right? Right. But like the intersection of them is kind of where we're gonna figure out how to move forward.

SPEAKER_05 6:18

And that's so important, right? Because I think when people communicate, like in the business or in personal lives, it's like right and wrong. And they want to really look at that black and white, but that doesn't matter. It's like you both be right, you could both be wrong, but how do we communicate through it? How do we actually take the next step?

SPEAKER_06 6:35

Yeah. Well, that's I mean, that's interesting because that's where I think the power of like working with a coach, working with a therapist comes in because you and I with our clients, we're not in the weeds with them. Right. We don't have that emotional tie, we don't have the clouded judgment, you know, based on you know, past experience. So we can sit there as a true outsider and observer and objectively kind of navigate what's going on, right? Absorb what they're saying, and then transmit it back in a way that they're like, oh fuck, like that's what is going on. And like we never could have you could see those patterns, right?

SPEAKER_05 7:12

That high level, like that visionary shit, right? Where you can have that top-down, you can see everything unfolding, you could see the dynamic. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 7:20

And a lot of times they lack the self-awareness, right? Like you have a visionary that starts a business who's wired a certain way, right? Gets distracted, a lot of different shit. They see shiny stuff. Present, yeah, you know, but they've been forced to also be like the the tactician and the execution person, which like depletes them of energy, which drains everything. Um it's creating the awareness of like it's okay to be fully you. And a lot of times they don't even know what that looks like. So you've got to kind of guide them into like what their true self is.

SPEAKER_05 7:52

Because you kind of forget who you really are. I mean, that's definitely, you know, I say all the time, like this whole journey with you has been completely therapy because I feel like I've forgot who I was, especially when I started the company, when I started the practice. And once we started, like, you know, the accountability chart and seeing you know who sits in one seat, in which seat, then I've started realizing, wow, no wonder why I'm so just resentful and cranky and everything, because I'm not getting to live in that creative visionary space at all.

SPEAKER_06 8:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 8:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 8:25

And like you think about it, right? This is where it starts to bleed out is like you think about someone that's in a marriage that's feeling that same way. Right. Like I don't feel like I'm living my true self, right? I'm making compromises for the other person. The intent is is from a pure place of love, but it starts to become self-sabotaging, right? Right. And then that's where that resentment starts to bleed in. So, like I said to you before, I think I stole from Simon Sinek, um, unspoken expectations are premeditated resentments. And without that clear ability to communicate, like, hey, this is what I need from you, right, as my spouse, and what you need from me, right? If we suppress that and try to assimilate to what is expected, right, that shit festers.

SPEAKER_05 9:11

Absolutely. And it it just becomes a a fucking disaster.

SPEAKER_06 9:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 9:16

Where do you think most people struggle with communication? Like what gets in the way?

SPEAKER_06 9:22

They think it's happened, right? So we talk about this in sessions. You know, if you think about like the kind of pathways of communication like what we're doing right now, the thoughts in my head make sense. They've got to leave my head, get to my mouth, be articulated out, enter your ears. Right. You've got to make sense of them in your brain, and like this is happening in a rapid fashion. Right. Right. Um so the impression is like because there's continuity between my words and thoughts, I think I've been clear about it.

SPEAKER_02 9:54

Right.

SPEAKER_06 9:54

But I don't know what's happened on the processing end of your side, right? So it's like if you do simple things, like you you tell someone something and just, hey, can you just repeat back to me? Like tell me what it is that I said to you. When they do that, you're gonna get that condensed version that they sort of, you know, those neural pathways make quick um dissociations. Yeah. And and when you get it back, you're like, yeah, there's things missing.

SPEAKER_05 10:18

Exactly. Right.

SPEAKER_06 10:18

And extrapolate that out, like, of course, shit's gonna get lost.

SPEAKER_05 10:22

Right.

SPEAKER_06 10:22

You know, it's a difficult thing.

SPEAKER_05 10:23

Right. So you're asking for clarity, right? Yeah. Because that's definitely what I've noticed is, you know, I think I'm being clear, but if I don't give enough space and time to ask that, like check for understanding, then the breakdown in communication is almost guaranteed to happen.

SPEAKER_06 10:39

Yeah. Well, I assume you know what I said. You assume you know what I said. Right. We both are making assumptions about the communication. Right. And then when it breaks down, we're like pointing fingers like, well, who fucked up?

SPEAKER_05 10:49

Right.

SPEAKER_06 10:49

It's like, well, both of us did.

SPEAKER_05 10:51

Right, exactly. Because neither of us asked, like, are we on the same page? Yeah. Yeah. So where do you see businesses really start to like tank? Is it communication? What kind of what is like the core thing that really gets in the way from a business actually being able to grow and scale?

SPEAKER_06 11:09

Communication is absolutely a big piece of it. Like, because the lack of communication starts to breed misalignment um and then frustration, right? So, you know, like when I first start working with my clients and like we discover core values, which is going to define the right person for the organization. Right. We create the accountability chart, get really clear on like what they own. Um, those two things together allow us to say, do we have the right people and do we have them in the right seats? Right. And I'll find clients by like the third or fourth session. Now they're starting to create the awareness of who the people issues are.

SPEAKER_00 11:41

Right.

SPEAKER_06 11:41

And we start talking about them. And just so hard. We do the people analyzer. Yep. And they're like, yep, that's it. Like it's very clear.

SPEAKER_05 11:49

Is literally everything in life, and I use it everywhere outside of work too. Do you think that's a good thing?

SPEAKER_06 11:53

Yeah. So do they get it? Yeah. They understand what the job is.

SPEAKER_05 11:56

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 11:56

Do they truly want to do it? Like get up every day excited. And then do they have the capacity to actually perform it well?

SPEAKER_00 12:02

Right.

SPEAKER_06 12:02

Um, but where I always pump the brakes is I'm like, how clear has this been communicated?

SPEAKER_00 12:08

Right.

SPEAKER_06 12:08

How often? Like, can you guys at this table as leaders regurgitate like that, your core value speech? And it's usually like, no, I have to pull it up. I'm like, well, if you don't fucking know it, I know for sure the rest of the business doesn't. Right. So now you're gonna sit here and tell me that we want to hold people to a standard that you haven't clearly communicated. Right. And that's kind of like the first time that they're like, fuck.

SPEAKER_05 12:31

Exactly. You have to live it. Those core values. I mean, I drove you crazy with how much I rewrote them in because I wanted to get them right.

SPEAKER_04 12:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 12:39

And it's really, you know, if we look through the therapy lens, it's acceptance and commitment therapy, right? That's very values-based. And it is so important. And then once I realized them, I really realized, wow, I could see where I'm not in alignment with them and not reiterating them to everyone that I work with.

SPEAKER_04 12:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 12:57

Of, you know, are we rewarding people based on owning your shit? Like, are we rewarding people like on giving a shit? Those are my values. And once we realize that, then it's easier to keep constant communication with the staff with those values in mind. So they're really like, oh yeah, that's like they're being reminded of those values. Like I beat everybody over the head with them because they're important.

SPEAKER_06 13:18

Yeah. Oh, they're, I mean, they're probably some of the most important work that you can do. And what you just described too is like when I look at it, there's kind of this pendulum swing. And I think you're now coming back towards the middle of it, right? The initial part of it, and this goes back to your question about the struggles, is not addressing the hard things. They're not having those conversations. They're letting people issues kind of exist. Um, there's not alignment on what the overall objective and strategy is for the business, but they're so ingrained in just the day-to-day that they really don't have time to get to that. Right. So that's kind of this side is that lack.

SPEAKER_00 13:53

Right.

SPEAKER_06 13:53

Once we create that clarity through those first three, four, five sessions, now it's like, okay, I have core values, I know what my core focus is. Like we see all of the things like that's all those issues are starting to pop out. They swing hard to the other side of like, yeah, all right, let's fix them all, right? Let's address them all. Yep. And it's like, no, you got to calm the fuck down because no one knows this stuff, right? Right. So once it gets communicated over and over, and and that is about creating the space in the business of you have to give people the tools, the support, the expectations, that all has to be clear before we can truly evaluate them.

SPEAKER_02 14:29

Right.

SPEAKER_06 14:29

When that starts to happen, they kind of start shifting back towards the middle. And that's really where the sweet spot is, right? Where those things have been clarified, we're having the difficult conversations, we're doing it regularly, and where everybody understands them.

SPEAKER_02 14:42

Right.

SPEAKER_06 14:42

Now we can truly look and say, okay, where are the problems that we now need to address?

SPEAKER_05 14:47

Exactly, exactly. Because the biggest thing I didn't take into account when we were doing is we talked about the people issues, and I was the biggest people issue. It was, it was me. And it took me a long time to see that. I don't know why. I don't know, like it was just like, oh, because I'm just like so hyper-focused.

SPEAKER_04 15:03

Yep.

SPEAKER_05 15:04

And then I was like, oh, people issues include analyzing me. And the biggest thing for me was capacity. I didn't have the capacity to do a lot. Um, and that was that was really, really huge. Yeah. And that like kind of self-reflection, yeah, that's so important.

SPEAKER_06 15:21

So we were talking about that outside before, right? Is like getting to that point. And this is where, you know, I was saying to you, it's so interesting because I'll be in session and I'll create awareness with a client of something that they need to like focus on.

SPEAKER_00 15:34

Right.

SPEAKER_06 15:34

And in on my head, I'm like, oh, that's that's for me. I gotta take that shit out of here. Yeah. Right. And a big piece of that is like kind of two things, like the controllable versus the uncontrollables, and then the extreme ownership mindset. Like I love Jocko's stuff because as a leader, like it does all come back to you. Like you're the one that's making all the decisions, right? So if somebody's fucking up, like you either didn't give them the tools and support that they need, you weren't clear about your expectations, right, or you hired the wrong person and allowed them to stay.

SPEAKER_00 16:03

Right.

SPEAKER_06 16:04

Right. So you need to fully own all that. Yep. Once you do, then you come back to the controllable versus uncontrollable. Um, the only things you can impact are the things that you have control over, right? So what I've realized in life is like the people who go through life and they're like, oh, it's everyone else's fault, it's circumstances, it's you know, there's always external situational.

SPEAKER_02 16:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 16:27

They're the ones that because it's an external blame, the solution is external, right? So they're relying on other people to change.

SPEAKER_05 16:36

Which feels really um anxiety provoking and trapped, right? Yeah, yeah. Q the mentality. Right.

SPEAKER_06 16:43

So once you can shift that and you're like, oh, this is my fault, right? Like I didn't show up to the job the way that I was supposed to. I didn't put the effort into the relationships like I was supposed to.

SPEAKER_00 16:53

Right.

SPEAKER_06 16:53

I surrounded myself by people who were, you know, surface level, superficial, right?

SPEAKER_00 16:58

Right.

SPEAKER_06 16:59

It's not their fault anymore, it's your fault. Right. You take ownership of that. Well, now you can develop the ability to move forward from that and change those things.

SPEAKER_05 17:08

Which is gonna be really important.

SPEAKER_06 17:09

But you know, yeah, things start fucking changing.

SPEAKER_05 17:11

Exactly.

SPEAKER_06 17:12

You know?

SPEAKER_05 17:12

Yeah, yeah. But but the discomfort with the change, right? Like I'm sure you, I know you've seen mine and I've been very honest about it. Can you speak a little bit about the kind of trend that you see when with businesses get to that point of embracing the discomfort?

SPEAKER_06 17:27

Yeah, so I think it's just you know, human um nature, right? It is like we want to be comfortable, we seek comfort, and especially the world that we live in. Like it's it's at our fingertips, right? You have to intentionally go seek out adversity. And, you know, I am absolutely the kind of person who's who's developed into this of truly embracing the adversity. Um that's why those hoodies that I gave you guys, I love it.

SPEAKER_05 17:51

It's the most comfortable.

SPEAKER_06 17:54

I can't take credit for it, but there's no growth in the comfort zone. And you look anywhere, right? Whether it's in the gym physically, it's in a relationship, it's in a business.

SPEAKER_03 18:01

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 18:02

We say in the Marine Corps all the time, complacency kills, right?

SPEAKER_03 18:05

I love that.

SPEAKER_06 18:06

US core value is grow or die. If you're not growing, you're dying. Like there is no in-between. That growth happens in discomfort and adversity, and like you have to seek it out. Um, and I kind of reflect on my life. And you know, the last time I was here, like talking to Adam, like going through some, you know, pretty significant events that happened to me. Like when I reflect on those, those things forced me to a place where I learned lessons I wouldn't have otherwise. Right. And once you can like appreciate that, those lessons that you take when you apply them on the uh other side of that, right? Right, that's where you hockey stick your life.

SPEAKER_05 18:43

Like it changes the fucking thing.

SPEAKER_06 18:47

Yeah. Um, so I think I see it with clients too, right? Like they get to a point where, like, you know, those first three sessions were just teaching, right? You're learning the tools, you're like, oh, we're gonna do fucking great, everything's gonna change. And and I'm sitting there like, it's not a motherfucker. Like, wait till quarterly's when we're in here, like going through issues, and you know, I'm starting to press you.

SPEAKER_02 19:06

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 19:06

And you're like, fuck, now we gotta face shit, you know?

SPEAKER_02 19:09

Right.

SPEAKER_06 19:10

Um, when they have the confidence and they trust the process enough, it's no different than working with a personal trainer, right? Like that shit's gonna hurt for a little while. And then at some point on the back end of it, when you see the change, when you see your body change, when you see the business change, that's where it clicks and you make that association. You're like, oh, there's something here. Right. Right. And and the clients that have the most success when that happens, they come in and they're like, all right, we want more discomfort. Like we want harder conversations, 100%. Cause then they start to realize like those what I told them on day one, those are the anchors.

SPEAKER_00 19:46

Right.

SPEAKER_06 19:46

That's the shit we're in here about. Scorecard, level 10, rocks, like, yeah. That's that's the surface.

SPEAKER_00 19:52

Right.

SPEAKER_06 19:53

It's all this other shit. It's how uncomfortable are you in this room? That's what's gonna move you forward.

SPEAKER_05 19:59

Right.

SPEAKER_06 20:00

You know?

SPEAKER_05 20:00

Yeah, and the connection is just so wild to me with EMDR because it's so similar where you know, you the stuff that comes up, it's so uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_04 20:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 20:10

And that means it's working. And we say it gets a little worse before it gets better.

SPEAKER_04 20:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 20:14

Like with EMDR, we have like phase two, which is like the resourcing and stabilization, and that's the um the like kind of prepping. So when things get uncomfortable, there's tools in the toolbox, so to speak. Um, things like um nervous system regulation, things like that. What would you say are are the tools from EOS? Like that, is that like the preparation for when shit gets really hard?

SPEAKER_06 20:37

Yeah, so I think what the tools do is it it provides a way to excuse me.

SPEAKER_05 20:44

Don't die.

SPEAKER_06 20:45

I'm trying not to.

SPEAKER_05 20:46

Please say living is yeah, knee jerk.

SPEAKER_06 20:49

To really like quantify and make something that is sort of subjective, right? Like objective, right? People analyzer is a great tool because you know when you look around the business, you're like, I have this like gut feel, like there's something off here, right? It's either a personality dynamic, something they don't fit in, they're missing something on their work, but like I can't put my finger on it, right? And that's always gonna be um a subjective thing. But when we create those parameters, right, we clarify with the accountability chart, like what does that person own? Like, what are the results they're driving to the business, right? And what are the values that this business exists on? Like, what's the DNA of this company? And you have those values, and we have the core value speech, and it clearly explains what each of those means. What does that look like? How do you show up? What does it not look like?

SPEAKER_02 21:40

Right.

SPEAKER_06 21:41

And then with GWC, like now this seat is very clear. Do you do you understand all the things in there? Is that what you get excited to do? Can you do it at a high level and perform real well?

SPEAKER_00 21:50

Right.

SPEAKER_06 21:51

Now that gut feeling, when you start looking at those things, you're like, oh fuck, I can contextualize this subjectiveness, right? And then the most important thing it comes. Back to the communication is now you can sit down with that person and have a structured conversation of expectations and clarity around what's working, what's not working, where those gaps are.

SPEAKER_05 22:14

You're able to give specifics.

SPEAKER_06 22:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 22:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 22:17

It's a clearer conversation. So it all comes down to like clarifying the communication and the expectations. Right.

SPEAKER_05 22:22

That data, right, is huge. Data is like such a big component of EOS. And it it really does help guide the conversations.

SPEAKER_04 22:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 22:30

Like, oh, when you tell me, you know, oh no, I think everything's going fine. Well, the the numbers say otherwise or whatever it is, like, you know, when a client is saying, no, I feel a lot better, but you're reporting higher on like when we do an anxiety assessment, it really points out that disconnect between like what we think and what's actually happening in reality.

SPEAKER_06 22:49

So you're establishing that that clear, like focal point. Right. Right. That's gonna set a baseline. And it's what I love about EOS is the simplicity of it. It's not easy, but it's simple, right? So when we talk about it, like someone who reports directly to you, your expectations them are very easy. It's really four things. Like, do they adhere to the core values? Do they GWC their seat? Are they hitting their rocks? And are they hitting the measurables?

SPEAKER_02 23:16

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 23:17

Right. So, like, are you the kind of person that fits in here? Can you perform your job well? Right. Are you getting the most important shit done every 90 days? And are you hitting those numbers each week that drives those 90 day priorities? And if you're doing all of those things, like you're gonna fucking kill.

SPEAKER_00 23:31

Right.

SPEAKER_06 23:32

You know what I mean? And if you're not, like at least now we've got a starting point of, hey, I know exactly where you're off track. Let's talk about why and how to get you back there.

SPEAKER_05 23:41

And what did those conversations use, let's say if it's someone who's like not meeting their their rocks, like they're not um doing their like picturing a client, right? These are our treatment goals and we're not getting there. And um, what do you usually find when those conversations happen?

SPEAKER_06 23:55

So the first thing I'm doing with the leadership team is I'm saying, look, before you even start pointing fingers, right, you're gonna look in the fucking mirror. Yep. Right. So go to your LMA and start going through those five leadership management self-assessment questions. And if you're not all yeses on those, like this is your thing that you got to fix before you start pointing at them. Right. Right. Um, are you creating the opening for them? Um, are you delegating things properly? Um, are you giving them your time and attention and the tools and the resources and the support that they need? Have you set very clear expectations? Have you had the conversations with them on a regular basis about what's not working and what's working? And then what is the tone of those conversations look like, right? Because you know, we we tell you it should be um 80% them talking, 20% you, which is probably a very similar dynamic in therapy where you're asking probing questions, you want to elicit from them and get them to start talking, right? Which is the data, telling dynamic.

SPEAKER_05 24:57

Exactly.

SPEAKER_06 24:57

You know, create the self-awareness, right? So it's like if you're not yeses to all those, we're not even gonna talk about this person as an issue unless they've done something egregious like theft, right? Right, right. Um, if you are all yeses, like then we start looking at okay, like, are we moving to three strikes? Like, have we truly like run the gonglet? Yeah, yeah. Um, and if if they're not it, like I'm gonna start pushing you guys, right?

SPEAKER_05 25:24

Right, because pressure, because it shows where well it goes back to the discomfort, right?

SPEAKER_06 25:28

We all seek comfort. And what I see with business owners is like, yeah, but I love them, right? And they've been here a long time. And I'm like, yeah, I get it, but you have 30 fucking employees, like their families are relying on you running this business in a way that's profitable so they can continue to persevere and like have a good life, right? Right. So we're gonna sacrifice them because of this one, right? Like you have to have that perspective. And and if they're not performing, like I guarantee you that person's coming in with a knot in their stomach every day.

SPEAKER_00 25:58

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 25:58

Fucking anxious. So if you really do love them, right, why would you want them in that environment every day to begin with?

SPEAKER_05 26:05

And feeling like shit. Yeah. And feeling so uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_06 26:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 26:08

Yeah. Yeah. And that's like such a big point that you made, right? Like, but I love them.

SPEAKER_04 26:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 26:12

And that's, you know, in therapy we call it codependency, right? Because you're basically you're changing your behavior based on how you feel about that person.

SPEAKER_06 26:21

So it's, I think another way to look at it too is, and this is like a self-reflection point, you know, if you have that employee where you feel that way, reframing for me, I think sometimes makes it a lot clearer. Like, if you were dating that person and this dynamic was going on, like what would your friends and your family tell you? Probably like, yo, get the fuck out of that relationship. Like, yeah, you love them, but like that's not it.

SPEAKER_05 26:43

Right.

SPEAKER_06 26:44

You know, like neither of you are happy. So what are we doing?

SPEAKER_05 26:47

My mom used to say that, and it took me a while to realize when she was right.

SPEAKER_06 26:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 26:51

Love's a feeling.

SPEAKER_06 26:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 26:53

We need both feelings and data and thoughts, right?

SPEAKER_06 26:56

Yep. Yeah. A hundred percent.

SPEAKER_05 26:58

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 26:59

But it just becomes a matter of just like with therapy, like, are they ready to acknowledge that and face it? You know?

SPEAKER_05 27:06

Right. Because I think if you um, you know, but I love them and I do that, and then you kind of forego your vision for that, that's self-abandonment.

SPEAKER_06 27:14

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 27:15

And then what are we doing for all these people that you've clarified the vision of the company for, but then you're abandoning yourself and not executing on it, that's gonna make shit really confusing for everybody in the workplace.

SPEAKER_06 27:26

Well, the the compounding effect to it is like, you know, people are a lot more aware than I think we give them credit for. And so your other employees are gonna see that you're saying this one thing, right? Your words are here and your actions are undermining it, and you're gonna lose credibility as a leader. And they're gonna be like, this is fucking bullshit.

SPEAKER_05 27:43

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 27:44

This is all lip service, like they don't really mean it. Right. You know, and so you know, you look at a business, it I don't care what what industry you're in, like what you're doing is trying to align human energy around a common objective.

SPEAKER_00 27:58

Right.

SPEAKER_06 27:58

That's it. That's that's care what you sell, do, or whatever it is.

SPEAKER_05 28:02

That is the best way to put it. It's so simple.

SPEAKER_06 28:04

And if if you are not being consistent, that human energy that you're trying to focus and you have people kind of like, this is bullshit, she's not doing what she says, right? It's gonna be an uphill battle, right? So you're shooting yourself in the foot. Again, it goes back to like, yeah, today's gonna be easy because I don't have to have that conversation, but tomorrow's gonna be so fucking hard because now I have 10 people that aren't bought in and they're all off on their own direction, and the energy is split, not focused.

SPEAKER_05 28:34

Yep, exactly. You know, exactly. And that's that's when the energy is scattered, like you know, those who are more emotionally focused feel it, they feel it viscerally. Then you can wait and look at a scorecard or something and see how the numbers reflect it.

SPEAKER_03 28:46

Yep, right.

SPEAKER_05 28:48

But you hit an important word, consistency. Where do you see people having like what makes it hard to be consistent?

SPEAKER_06 28:56

Discomfort. You know? Um so the L10, like that's where all this happens, right? And the way I always frame this up for clients is I'm like, your strategic win is gonna happen at the tactical level, right? You look at like in the Marine Corps, the battle for Fallujah, it was a huge strategic win in that war. Um that was one at the tactical level, right? It was the fire team and squads that were house by house, just clearing one room at a time, lock that house down, hit the next one, right? Over and over. You got a block cleared, we're moving to the next one. Those tactical wins compound um when executed with discipline, with maniacal execution, that gets maniacal.

SPEAKER_05 29:38

I love that, I love that. I love that love that yeah.

SPEAKER_06 29:40

Um, for you guys, that's your L10s, right? That is that is the point of friction. That's where we're tracking are those rocks on track, right? Because if you do four quarters of hitting rocks, you're gonna hit that one-year plan, right? Which is gonna set you up for the three year and then ultimately the 10 year, right? You're tracking your scorecard. If you're hitting those scorecard numbers every week, you're probably gonna hit the rocks, right? That compounds out.

SPEAKER_02 30:01

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 30:02

Um, you have the opportunity to hold each other accountable to the things week over week you said you were gonna do that are solving issues and then creating the space for that open conversation of like what's all the shit that's getting in our way?

SPEAKER_00 30:14

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 30:14

What are the things that can hold us back that we've got to address?

SPEAKER_00 30:17

Right.

SPEAKER_06 30:18

Um they can be clunky, right? At first when you're learning them. And then once you get the format down, you're like, oh yeah, we got it, right? But if you look at your issues list and the things that you guys are talking about each week, it's like, are these, is this really what's going on? Right. Um, when I have issues come up in sessions and everyone kind of looks shocked, right? But I know the issue's been going on for six months. I'm like, where the fuck has this been over the last 90 days on your L10?

SPEAKER_00 30:42

Right.

SPEAKER_06 30:43

Like, why are we waiting for me to pull it out of you when you guys all knew what was going on?

SPEAKER_00 30:48

Right.

SPEAKER_06 30:49

So it's the avoidance of discomfort again. Right. That's where it stems from.

SPEAKER_05 30:53

Right. Um, so yeah, that like it's like we kind of say in therapy, like you're too emotional, right? It's hard to be consistent.

SPEAKER_04 31:00

Yep.

SPEAKER_05 31:00

So it's that definitely that avoidance of anything that is, you know, uncomfortable conversations can bring up a lot of anxiety and that makes people want to run the other direction.

SPEAKER_06 31:10

100%. I mean, I I always correlate what we do um to going to the gym, right? It's like gym's gonna hurt. You're gonna have days, you're gonna wake up. It should. It's supposed to. I don't want to go. Right. Right. And it's like, I don't fucking care. Right. Like you said you wanted this thing, right? Right. You want this body, you want to feel this way.

SPEAKER_05 31:28

Right.

SPEAKER_06 31:28

You still want that? Yeah. Then fucking go.

SPEAKER_05 31:30

Get up. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 31:31

Like that's it. Yep. Um, and it's the same thing, right? Right. You've got to do those things over and over and over. Right. Make that choice. And it's, you know, kind of a cliche statement at this point, but it's like motivation is fleeting.

SPEAKER_05 31:43

It's I say that all the time. It's discipline, right?

SPEAKER_06 31:46

You're making a commitment to yourself. I'm going to do this. Right. I'm going to address the issue. I'm going to have this meeting. I'm going to fucking execute.

SPEAKER_00 31:53

Right.

SPEAKER_06 31:54

Right. Because on the other side of that hard stuff is everything that you're looking for in the business.

SPEAKER_05 31:59

Exactly. And then sometimes I've noticed like it's, let's say if we're in in a session, whatever, and it's just it, these things keep coming up. It's well, let's kind of like go back to the goal, right? And this is where I love that you did the smart goal thing of like, was that a realistic goal that we were shooting for? Is that what you actually wanted? Well, let me kind of go back now and see. And um, like, uh, it's not really what I wanted. It's what I thought I was supposed to want. Yeah. It's a the the fear of being really honest about like what you want. I think that's a lot of people get really um stuck on that.

SPEAKER_06 32:34

They do. And it's scary because I mean you you kind of look at how people are in relationships, right? That's what they tend to do. Unless you have someone who's truly done the reflection and fully embraced, like, this is who I am, right? I'm gonna show up unapologetically.

SPEAKER_00 32:51

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 32:51

That's gonna cost relationships, but those are not the ones I want anyway. Yeah. Because the ones that are left that I'm that are drawn into that, that cohesion is so fucking strong. Um, and the same thing happens in the business, right? Once you get to that point where you can unapologetically be like, this is what the fuck I want.

SPEAKER_00 33:11

Right.

SPEAKER_06 33:11

And I'm not going to compromise on it. Right. Some people are gonna leave.

SPEAKER_05 33:15

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 33:16

That's okay.

SPEAKER_05 33:17

Exactly.

SPEAKER_06 33:17

The ones that are left though are gonna double the fuck down and you're gonna go.

SPEAKER_05 33:21

Right. And it doesn't have to be a judgment thing. It's not like, oh, fuck them. They they don't like people are different. They might not have the same wants as you, and that's okay. Like they're allowed, just like how you are allowed to express what you want, so are they.

SPEAKER_04 33:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 33:34

And that's really big. I think everyone gets stuck on that of like that, like they should agree with me. It's like, no, like everyone's allowed to and again, you go back to the relationship thing.

SPEAKER_06 33:43

Like if you're dating someone or you're married to someone and you need to shrink who you are for them, what would your friends and family say? They'd be like, that's not the right place to get out.

SPEAKER_05 33:52

Exactly. Right.

SPEAKER_06 33:52

So why would you not do the same thing with your business?

SPEAKER_05 33:55

Exactly. That that component is huge. Um, so I know we're running out on time. So what I want to do is bull pause here, but we're definitely gonna pick up for part two because there's so much more to unpack. Perfect. Dan, you have so much to offer. Tell a little bit about where people can find you and if they want to find out more information about how you can help them.

SPEAKER_06 34:13

Yeah, absolutely. So uh I think the best place is my Instagram, DanSingerEOS. Um, I really lean into understanding like who I am to see if there's a personality fit there. Um, and that's kind of the intentionality around the Instagram.

SPEAKER_05 34:28

Good workout videos. Yeah. I love them. There's someone speaking.

SPEAKER_06 34:31

If you want some thirst traps, like about a month before you just go. He does, yeah. Um, and then I'm LinkedIn too, and then you can just Google dancing or EOS.

SPEAKER_05 34:39

Awesome. Thank you so much for being here. I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_06 34:41

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_05 34:42

We'll see you on part two. Thank you for listening to another episode of the Truth About Healing Podcast. If you know someone who's still stuck, share this episode with them. Because as you know, the truth can set them free. And if you're ready to get started to see what you need to repair, contact us at peacefulliving mental health counseling.com and we will get you started. Until next time, I'm Dana Coretta Stein, reminding you we repeat what we don't repair. This podcast is for informational purposes only and is not a substitute for professional mental health or medical advice. Listening does not create a therapist client relationship. If you need support, contact a licensed professional or your local emergency services.